Why Your Hardest Days Are Your Best Investments with Nathan Shields

In this powerhouse episode of the Will Power Project, Will sits down with long-time collaborator and industry leader Nathan Shields (Founder of the Private Practice Owners Club). Nathan has navigated the entire entrepreneurial lifecycle—from grinding out paper notes at 4:00 AM in a single clinic to scaling, selling, and now coaching hundreds of other owners.

The conversation centers on a pivotal moment in Nathan's recent career: having to fill two hours of "dead air" at a high-stakes workshop with zero preparation. He reveals how decades of "business ownership tuition" allowed him to facilitate a masterclass off the cuff, proving that your past struggles are actually a well of wisdom waiting to be tapped.

In this episode, we break down:

• The "Technician’s Trap": Why being a great therapist is often the biggest hurdle to becoming a great business owner.
• The Price of Tuition: Reflecting on the "millions" lost to inefficiency and why hiring a coach is cheaper than letting life teach you the hard way.
• Judgment vs. Effort: Relearning your value as your business grows from $1M to $3M and beyond.
• The Courage to Confront: Why your growth velocity is directly proportional to your ability to have hard conversations.
• A Message from the Future: What a 90-year-old version of yourself would say about your current business stress (Spoiler: It involves more grace and more moisturizer).

Connect with Nathan Shields

• Podcast: Private Practice Owners Club (Over 350 episodes of industry-leading content).
• Community: Join the Private Practice Owners Club Facebook Group.
• Fractional CFO Program: Reach out to Nathan directly at nathan@ppoclub.com to learn about the Profit Intelligence Program and plug the revenue leaks in your practice.
• Upcoming Event: Join the PPO Club Conference in San Antonio, October 15th–17th, 2026.

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Transcript

Welcome And Shared Backstory

SPEAKER_02 0:02

So, Nathan, thank you for being on Willpower. I'm so excited to be in this another collaboration. How many podcast episodes do you think we've done together between your show?

SPEAKER_01 0:11

On my podcast, I you're probably in the 20s.

PPOClub Podcast And Events

SPEAKER_02 0:14

Isn't that amazing how much time you and I have spent? You better believe it. Number one, in that episode, crushed. Did it really? It crushed. It gave me all sorts of false hopes for the next 10. And then I had some great guests, but you were just such a powerhouse. So no, it was a phenomenal introduction. I can't thank you enough for your support. And you know, you're at the stage where it's interesting, I think, for for entrepreneurs to hear because you're you've gone through the whole life cycle. You were PT, you had a practice, you grew the practice, you sold the practice. We at some point there was a me in there at some point, but there was an initial stage without me. And then afterwards you started doing other things, you've grown and scaled. I think the story that I wanted you to start with is this idea of what happened at your last event. Okay. So tell the audience about your events and then tell me about, you know, just what happened.

SPEAKER_01 1:06

Yeah, so me and my uh my partner have Private Practice Owners Club, which is our podcast that I've been doing for like five, six years. Can you believe we've got, I want to say like 350 episodes? That's insane. It's pretty crazy. Uh and I think it's amazing content for private practice owners. It's the best podcast in the industry.

SPEAKER_02 1:25

Okay. It is the best. Thank you. I'm chasing you. I like I like having people to chase.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

Thank you. That makes me feel good. Um, it's got great stuff. We also have a coaching company that coincides with that. That Adam and I have built off of that.

SPEAKER_02 1:38

Adam Robin, the great and wonderful.

SPEAKER_01 1:39

He's awesome. And because we have a coaching company, I think we're obligated, aren't you obligated a little bit to have conferences? And so we've been doing in-person conferences. We've had our second conference in this last October. Um but we also decided to do some smaller these workshops. Yeah, intimate workshops. How many people instead of like 150 people at an event, this is more like 20, 30 people in a room, right? And and we can be a little bit more intimate, get into the weeds a little bit more, maybe focus on a particular topic and one singular topic for a day and a half. So we had this the annual strategic planning workshop that we did in January, early January 2026, to help owners map out their priorities and goals for the year. The same exercise that you and I went through multiple times with Scott Fritz, we just I just tried to expand that to the group and took them through that. Um and there what was interesting is I thought I was done. I according to our agenda, I was done. And as after doing that, but then things happened the next day where all of a sudden we had two hours of like a dead space.

SPEAKER_02 2:46

Two hours. So people are like looking for something and then there's just this open space.

The Two-Hour Agenda Surprise

SPEAKER_01 2:51

It was yeah, it was after our morning break, we come back, and there's two hours to work through until lunch, essentially. That's the agenda. And um, and so I had to come up with something. Like, what are we gonna do now? Like, this is my conference, all these people paid for it. How many people were there? We had 26 people in this room. Yes, and they paid for it. Yeah, they'd done their annual strategic planning, but the agenda says that we got two more hours of this and then we've got lunch, right? And so um, yeah, that was that was kind of scary, but interestingly, I felt semi-confident like that it was just gonna work out. Really? Well, you and I now, now have been in front of enough people and enough groups like that that we we've had enough experience and we've done enough things that we could come up with something.

SPEAKER_02 3:48

Right. You had this base experience that made that helped provided a degree of confidence in the face of this recent shift.

SPEAKER_01 3:54

Right, right. And so an exercise that you and I have done, especially in a small group like that, is like, hey, what kind of issues are you guys dealing with right now? I'm gonna just call them out and I'm gonna write them on the board. Yeah. And moderate that discussion with this group. Like, which one do you want to talk about first? Let's go. Yeah. Okay, who else is having that issue? What is your issue? Give us some context. Okay, does anyone has anyone want to solve that? And then I share from my experience as well if I can. And then we just kinda kind of like cross things off as we go down the list. That covered about an hour, hour and 15 minutes, and I'm like, let's go take a break. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because I needed the break. I didn't know what I was gonna do next. And during that break, I'm looking over some notes and like, oh, what else can we talk about? How can how can we get this valuable for the last 45 minutes? And and then they came back and like, okay, this is the things, these three things we're gonna talk about regarding your priorities and goals. What can you do to enhance them and give them more life, give them more energy, make them more impactful, have a greater um vision for 2026, and then we were able to talk through that for 45 minutes and then went to work. Huge hit. And afterwards, I was just like, I'm really I honestly, I was like kind of proud of myself. Yeah, like I I I can say I I can't say where did that come from. I know where it came from, like I've been through enough of those, but to have the skill set to be able to do that is something I could have never imagined in my wildest dreams, even 10 years ago.

SPEAKER_02 5:26

Right.

SPEAKER_01 5:26

Right?

Improvised Coaching That Hits

SPEAKER_02 5:27

And I know you've gone through a lot of the same stuff, and I think it's important to talk about though, because I think it's really useful as PTs who are listening to this, who are different stages. We have students, we have new grads, we've got young business owners, experienced business owners, pediatric clinics and pelvic floor, it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_01 5:44

Allied healthcare.

SPEAKER_02 5:45

All these all these all these people who are going through this journey are hearing what most people would consider their own personal hell, which is hey, you have a group of people that you have to speak to for two hours that you didn't know you had to, go. And by the way, they paid you and you have to make it amazing.

SPEAKER_01 5:59

Yeah, isn't that a Seinfeld joke?

SPEAKER_02 6:00

Like to be speaking at the funeral, more people would rather be in the coffin than actually speaking. Dying is number two. Public speaking is number one. So for you to be able to pop up and knock that out and not have like a big pressure, because I want to say this it is scary. It is incredibly hard. And learning how to develop that muscle for all of us, I don't care how good any of us look on stage or in facilitating, but it was to me that what was really powerful, Nathan, was this idea that that moment for me was a reflection of, as I've known you over 20 years now, how how much you've evolved. You know, I met you after having one location, you had one location, and we were looking at expanding a second one together. And I think your job offer was, well, what do you think? And I think that was the big offer. It was like there was like there was nothing written. We didn't go for any terms.

SPEAKER_01 6:48

What do you think about Florence, Arizona? Right. Not just what do you think? What do you think about this desert hellscape called Florence?

SPEAKER_02 6:56

It tells you there was divine intervention when what you were selling was the middle of nowhere, Arizona, with 18 prisons. I drove, we drove together for 45 minutes away from my home, and you said, without any terms, what do you think? And I went, I think it's pretty good. Like, let's roll.

SPEAKER_03 7:14

All right, let's do it.

SPEAKER_02 7:15

Best offer. I don't know what you're paying me. I don't know what the, you know, and it but it turned into this place where now you're you're facilitating owners in a room off the cuff. So what I wanted this, this is the the show for today. Key lessons learned in your journey of personal evolution in the physical therapy space. Um, let's go back in time. What were some of the earliest challenges that you had to face as a young business owner? Let's go right into that level of of entrepreneurship. What were you saying were some of the hardest things you had to endure or figure out when you were starting out?

SPEAKER_01 7:47

Like opening the clinic was, of course, a leap of faith, and it was scary. And some of my earliest challenges, like, dude, I do not want to market. Like going and starting a conversation with people that don't necessarily want to see me or weren't expecting to see me, and somehow ingratiate them and have them send you clients. Dude, I would sit outside in my truck and like just listen to music for 10 minutes before going.

SPEAKER_02 8:19

You're like Dwight in the office listening to that heavy metal song before you go in.

Early Ownership Fear Marketing Leadership

SPEAKER_01 8:23

I just didn't want not to pump me up. I just didn't want to go in. Like, I don't want to do this. But I knew, but I had a goal, right? I knew that's what needed to be done. And back in the day, physician referrals, I like I didn't have anything else. There was no social media. So what else am I gonna do? And so um learning that skill set. I'm still I still don't feel like then I'm the strongest marketer, you know that. Um, but it's something that I had to do was just talk to people. Um I think it helps, of course, based on our background, because you and I we were in Boy Scouts, probably had some leadership positions in Boy Scouts to stand in front of the other boys. Oh, isn't it right? As a troop leader or something like that. And then at church, of course, we have opportunities to speak in front of the congregation from a young age.

SPEAKER_02 9:16

Yes, in our church that we invite youth up every Sunday.

SPEAKER_01 9:19

Yep. And then um, of course, being a missionary and two years strangers all the time who do not want to talk to you.

SPEAKER_02 9:26

And you're in Japan, by the way, which I have got totally new appreciation for you going in that language trying to talk to strangers at a culture that likes to keep to itself. Oh, yeah, yeah. In Guatemala, it was like key, and all these people are like, na-da! And you go and you start talking to them. But like you're talking to people in a culture that's very formal.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

Yeah, so I had that that didn't change the fact that I didn't want to be there. I didn't want to be talking to you. So just building on that was extremely difficult. Um, my my vision was, man, if I could have me and another provider, and we could, and maybe a PTA and a tech or two, and if I saw 150 visits a week, killing it.

unknown 10:07

Made it. Killing it.

SPEAKER_01 10:08

I just I've made it. This is the best. And Whitney and I told ourselves, Whitney's my wife, um we told ourselves, if we can get a TiVo, do you remember TiVo? Boop boop boop boop boop boop. You remember that sound? If we can afford a TiVo, then we know we've made it. Right? Dating myself now.

SPEAKER_02 10:28

So if I could only get an eight-track.

SPEAKER_01 10:30

Right. It's crazy how how your purposes change over the years. Yeah. And and so getting to that point was like, this is cool. Maybe there's more. This is cool. Well, one sucks, one clinic's doing all right, maybe I can do a second one. The entire time not building any systems, totally people dependent, totally, I mean, you know, I gave you zero support.

SPEAKER_02 10:55

Emotionally, you were great though. I mean, I mean this sincerely, like uh actual processes and like mentorship, no. When it came to like, hey, like feeling like a part of something special and being led by someone who cares about what they're doing, which is I'm learning in retrospect, is like 80% of it. So no, you were you were fantastic in those ways. Scalable, no, you couldn't provide that because you didn't know it.

SPEAKER_01 11:15

Yeah. So learning those things along the way were difficult and slow in coming. Because I think you and I both would agree we we should have gotten some kind of consulting or coaching earlier. I don't think we knew about that. We didn't necessarily know what it was, right? Yeah. I don't think there was the the coaching wasn't nothing. No. That wasn't even.

SPEAKER_02 11:35

It was seen down, it was looked down on. Like I before when you and I first worked together, I will tell you that it was my like emotional breakdown that for me led to some sort of effort in coaching. I reached out to that measurable solutions company because I was just like broken, and that's when you and I kind of started together. But it wasn't like I mean, it was desperation. It wasn't anything other than that.

SPEAKER_01 11:54

Yeah, that's true. And and we um and so learning how to lead, like my initial interview questions were my my explanation to someone of what they were supposed to do in an interview was like I literally said these words your job is to do whatever I tell you to do. That was 1950s, Dad. That was my level of leadership because I didn't know what else to say or do. Yeah. I'm I need to treat patients. Right. So do what I ask you to do. Do everything else so I can treat patients. That that was my sole purpose, that was my that was my goal, that's what all my education led to up until that point was to treat patients. Yeah, so head down, treat patients, you guys figure out the rest of it, which isn't leadership, that's just being a therapist, and and that who happens to own a business, right? And so those were tough lessons because number one, I could see some of the lessons involved people looking at me and knowing they had lost respect.

SPEAKER_02 12:57

I've had that look many a time, my friend. Oh, yeah. That glance of like, you don't know what you're doing.

SPEAKER_01 13:03

Yeah, you're a really stupid business owner. And I'd be like, just do what I told you to do. Yeah, don't judge me. I'm gonna fire you. Yeah, right. Uh so learning that, um just learning um how to it's a hard lesson to because you get to a point where you hate your work. Yeah. Or you don't enjoy your own company. It's your company, and you're just like, I hate this.

SPEAKER_02 13:36

I started hating my life.

SPEAKER_01 13:38

Yeah. I can't go on vacation because that's when hell's gonna break loose at the company I'm gonna go to come on.

SPEAKER_02 13:43

And you're judged as like the guy that's living for money.

SPEAKER_01 13:46

And I have to answer all the calls because no one else has any answers or problem solving skills. And life just wasn't fun, man. You know, waking up at 4 a.m. to do my paper and pencil notes so I could get to work at 6, 6 30, coming home at 7 p.m. You know.

SPEAKER_02 14:03

Rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat.

Burnout And No Systems

SPEAKER_01 14:06

And financially, I was doing okay, right? And that wasn't the issue. It was just like my life sucked. And I didn't know what to do. I I think part of it is I'm I'm a pretty even keel dude. So like I wasn't necessarily emotional about it. I think I was I think it was more of this is just how we do things, this is how small business owners do things. And I didn't know any other way than to just nose to the grindstone it, right? And and so those were difficult lessons for sure. But like yeah recognizing where I could have led more financial impact besides that, because I didn't know how to hold people accountable, how to track KPIs, you name it, how to track my cash. How many tens of thousands of dollars did we lose?

SPEAKER_02 14:59

Millions, you mean? I don't know. I try not to think about it. You know what though, I do say this. I think I like to look at that as that was that was us investing in our learning. And it's funny because like that was right. Exactly. And there's kind of like that price tag is gonna vary by person to person based on their background support, um, but ultimately their ability to be coachable and trainable.

SPEAKER_03 15:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:20

Because I've saw, dude, since I've coached people, I've met people in their 70s who are still at that stage after 50 years of running businesses or 40 years of running businesses that long. So their price tag, they're learning different lessons, I would say. And I don't think that we're better off than they are in terms of like we're better people. I think the lessons they've learned are deeper. Financial, yes.

SPEAKER_01 15:41

Well, just some of the quality of life.

SPEAKER_02 15:43

Quality of life, no question. Yes. So they are learning, but it's it's like that's the price, I guess. But so what would you say if you're go, if you went what would you tell the audience, like the main three or four things that you learned from that timeframe that has everything to do with being able to jump on stage and speak for two hours. And maybe those are disconnected, maybe, but what would you say in that time frame when you were struggling through all that? What was happening in terms of education for you?

SPEAKER_01 16:09

I was really learning what it means to be a business owner. Because you could do the technical therapy very well as a as a business owner, otherwise you don't have any business. You don't have the confidence to branch out on your own. Um But to truly be a business owner and on top of that, what does it take to be a business owner? Is one category, like the organization and the meetings and the agendas and the statistics and all this kind of stuff. It's a it's another category altogether to learn leadership. So all I learned was the leadership uh that I had learned in Boy Scouts and and um and through church leadership positions and whatnot. But those are, I mean, I'm leading a bunch of kids that want to be scouts or don't even want to be there, right? And in a church leadership position is a bunch of volunteers that have no impact on my financial well-being or anything like that. Now these are people that I'm actually paying to be there. How do I get them to move in a certain way in a certain direction? And and then how do I, you know, you know what it was is um how do I take control of my life?

SPEAKER_02 17:33

Hmm. Because you were being at the effect of all these things. Well, and now you're taking control.

SPEAKER_01 17:38

Yeah, think about being therapists, we are at the effect of our schedule. So the schedule fills up, and that tells us when we're busy and when we're not. Yeah. Because patients either come in or they don't. And if I'm gonna have free time, it's because someone didn't sign up on that appointment slot.

SPEAKER_02 18:00

Which is incentivizing in that way for people.

SPEAKER_01 18:02

Yeah, and so but that's and so we cede our control to the schedule. We are slaves to the schedule. And it took me close to a decade to understand that if this is gonna go anywhere, I am fully responsible for getting it there myself. And it's not gonna go anywhere unless I take control and say, This is what I'm doing, this is what you're doing, this is what the business will do, and taking ultimately taking control.

Coaching Accountability And Control

SPEAKER_02 18:37

It feels to me like, and this is where it starts to sound maybe more cliche to people, but it's so powerful through the lens of what you just shared, is that you stopped letting go of like you started letting go of like blaming others, you started taking full accountability that everything was up to you.

SPEAKER_03 18:53

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:54

And not in a martyrdom, like, oh, it's all my phone, like I it's like it's more like, no, I am the captain of my fate or whatever that phrase is. I am what is it? Captain of my ship. Captain of my fate.

SPEAKER_01 19:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:08

Anyway. You're the you're the general of of your future or whatever. So you're the you're the colonel of of your calendar. So like the idea is that you decided everything, kind of like Jack O'Wilco with that book, Extreme Uh Ownership, the idea that you took extreme ownership of your world and said, This is up to me.

SPEAKER_01 19:27

I had to do something. I had to take control, yeah, right? And um and it and it started with, you know, I think we initially were doing stuff together at Entrepreneurs Organization, right? EO, yeah. Yeah, with EO, Accelerator. And they were they were talking about stuff like um, I don't know, values and purpose and knowing your metrics and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_02 19:49

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:50

What are you guys talking about? Different language. The people actually believe in like you kind of heard those things, but you're like, that's for other businesses. Purpose, vision, values is foo-foo. Yeah, that's what is that gonna do? How's that gonna make me more money? Yeah, totally. And uh and or then eventually we started getting some coaching and consulting, like, yeah, you need to take five hours out of your week and work on your business. And you're like, how what?

SPEAKER_02 20:15

I remember that thinking that was insane. Like, I'm gonna lose, I'm barely making a profit, and now I'm gonna cut out you know, five to ten visits in those five hours because I was seeing a lot. You know, like that's how many, how many hundreds of dollars was that?

SPEAKER_01 20:29

Yeah, oh, per week, right? It's funny you say that because one of my first coaching clients, Steve in Vegas, um yeah, he called me to get some coaching, and he remembers, I don't remember this. I but I told him, I said, listen, I need to meet with you once a once a month, not during your lunch hour. And that he said that blew his mind. He's like, how could I possibly how did how could that possibly work that way for one hour a month to sit with my coach? It's heartbreaking. Isn't that crazy? Yeah. Uh I mean we can say that now. But I felt that way myself. But we did feel that way. Yeah, I totally felt that way. And so, yeah, taking control in that regard and then learning what it meant to be a business owner.

SPEAKER_02 21:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:16

Right. It's it's um those are that's a that's an education that we had to have that we never got, of course, from our therapy programs or from our undergraduate programs. We had to pay the tuition, either in lost revenue or with coaching. You can do either one. If you want to lose less money, you get the coach first. If you want to lose more money, don't get the coach. And let life teach you the lesson over a long period of time. Hurts a lot more. Uh but um, yeah, that was those were some those were some that's when that's when I actually started having. Fun in my business. Interesting. I don't know about you. I uh the we've had this conversation before years ago. Like, if someone could just take over the business side of things. Oh, and let me try. And let me let me just let me treat all day. Oh, I just want to see patients all day. Yeah, man. That was the dream. But you and I kind of something happened.

SPEAKER_02 22:24

And it's funny because like it if if we're not messaging it correctly, it looks like we're just stopping treating. But what we see is the evolution of we enjoy so much more working on the business because you see the impact on the patients and the employees. And the employees.

SPEAKER_01 22:37

Yeah. That's what the cool that's that was the cool part. Like, oh wait, I can be an influence on more than just this patient that I'm working on. Of course, I get value from that, and that's what I learned all these decades to get to the point of. But now I'm learning this, I'm creating the skill set and these tools to have more than just a musculoskeletal impact.

SPEAKER_03 23:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:06

And more on leading people and driving their purpose and coaching them, and have that being a greater effect on multiples of people outside of myself and that one-on-one interaction that I have with treating. So that was I've you and I, I'm assuming not to speak for you, but find so much more fulfillment, right? Yes. Purpose in making that kind of impact now that like treating patients just it doesn't cut it for us.

SPEAKER_02 23:35

Well, when we were partners at Rise, I you and I both talked how much we love that people love to treat in our like like it was almost like we could never find that full fulfillment because of the many hats we had to wear. So when we took over the leadership hat and we were able to grow the company in a way that was actually somewhere fun to work and we were having fun, yeah, the physical therapists, PTAs, the front desk, the billers, they all started loving it. And that was what was so fulfilling was that they we created an environment in the industry we love for people to do what they love and not have to feel that stress, and they were getting compensated fairly, if not generously. And that evolution was so much more satisfying than me trying to just treat my 25 patients in an hour. I was gonna say a day, an hour, and and then like somehow like run payroll. Like there was just there was no there was that to me, I think you're right. I think that was such a satisfying experience.

SPEAKER_01 24:27

Yeah, and as we invested in them, you could see light bulbs going off in their minds and you could see their growth. Yeah. And they were feeling fulfilling purposes that they hadn't dreamed of either. Yes. Like, because I'm assuming Michelle, one of your right-hand men, women, is would have been in the same boat. Like if I could just treat patients. She would have been the same path.

SPEAKER_02 24:49

Any of those entrepreneurs, do you remember? Um, oh gosh, girl from Wyoming, whose name Kayla. Kayla. Yes. She was so amazing. She was awesome. And where is she now?

SPEAKER_01 24:59

She has her own business.

Finding Fulfillment In Leadership

SPEAKER_02 25:00

How many locations now? Like it probably, I think she's at three. Is she really? Yeah, I stalk her a little. So like it's it's but like you know what I'm saying? But she jumped, she got to go through that process because we modeled it well, and we taught her the way to where our suffering was was turned into our knowledge and then turned into edifying others. Not that they had it easy, but they had clarity in a way that you and I never had until we started like exploring options for the first time.

SPEAKER_01 25:25

We definitely learned from our mistakes.

SPEAKER_02 25:28

Minimally a roadmap of what not to do.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

Yes. Exactly. Exactly. So it was cool. It was in that space then, you know, that we're growing the business, we're growing a leadership team that we're super proud of. Yeah. Right. And people that would stand up and say, Oh man, I know I can make more money other places, but I would much rather be here because these are my people, right?

SPEAKER_02 25:52

They I love it here, and they would cry. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 25:55

And having having creating something like that was so fulfilling, right? And but we had to learn some skills and tools to get to that point still.

SPEAKER_02 26:03

What were your what were the hardest ones for you to learn? Like for you personally, what would you say were the hardest ones? Were they certain interpersonal skills? Was it certain like leadership elements? Was it like holding account someone of was it firing people? Was it hiring? Was it um money? Was it like where would you put like for you the greatest the greatest turnaround was?

SPEAKER_01 26:20

Well, it's something that I'm still working on. It's not a strength of mine, is confrontation, like having clarity conversations, holding someone accountable, that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_02 26:30

I think that's true for most people, by the way.

SPEAKER_01 26:32

Yes, it is. Um people have an inclination to get it done more quickly. Like I'll drag my feet.

SPEAKER_03 26:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:43

Most people don't want to do it, but some people, maybe they'll maybe they're the minority. Like I think about Adam, my partner. Yeah. And if something's rubbing him the wrong way, he's gotta talk about it. He's like, Oh, hold on, we need to go talk about this really quick. Whereas I'm like, let me think about it.

SPEAKER_02 26:56

And his courage to confront, I've never seen it in another person like that.

SPEAKER_01 27:01

And that's directly proportional to his growth. Yeah. His ability to cr confront the person or the issue is directly proportional to his growth. Like he's grown at a speed and a velocity that is significantly different than most. And I think you'll see that in most people. I mean, you've coached enough people, you you work with enough owners that the ones who like make the decisions, make have the conversations, make changes faster are the ones that are opening their third, fifth, tenth, fifteenth clinic.

SPEAKER_02 27:31

And they seem less stressed, ironically.

unknown 27:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:33

Isn't that? I mean, it's true. Like they've the ones that are like, hey, let's hit this head on, they make more mistakes quicker, they learn from them faster, but they they don't stop. Yeah, they get to these plateaus so much faster. There's a guy I was on his show earlier today, who's uh Brad Powell, huge shout out to his podcast. Um, and just him in general. He's a younger guy, younger meaning like almost 40, which is so irritating. But you know, like in his late 30s, he's got this amazing like multi-location business going with, and he's pivoting the government for change in Utah, where he's successfully, he was a lead on helping make uh physical therapy considered private practice or what's it called direct access, not direct access. It's called uh being a primary care. Primary care provider. And so now they're changing the language to where insurances have to like lower their con their co-pays because they're not specialties. They're not specialties anymore. So like he's doing that and he's like in his late 30s and he's got three locations and more profitable. So it's like it's interesting to see how some people like Adam and Brad have just got that gift and they can just run, you know.

SPEAKER_01 28:36

Yeah, that that's a tough one for me. That's still a tough one for me, but I at least I feel like I have the ability to confront and I can and I have the verbiage behind it. Yeah. And I mean, you and I we've reven read enough books that we can understand some of the premises and foundations as to where to start, and it's not coming from a place of not knowingness. Yeah, right. Right. And so we have the capacity. Um so that that was a tough one to get over. The other is um I I feel like I'm even still held aback because you and I both have done the um oh, is it was it rocket fuel that has the visionary and the uh integrator.

SPEAKER_02 29:19

It's a controller, it was the controller integrator and visionary or rocket fuel, which is part of the EOS.

SPEAKER_01 29:25

Yeah, and I've taken that personality, that exam multiple times, and I'm equal parts visionary integrator. Yeah. Like the score is 82, 85, 85, 82. That's so funny. So for me, like where you and Adam offset me in a big regard is you guys are heavily visionary. Right? And so that that holds me back a little bit. Oh, I see. You know what I mean? It's something that I really have to work on. And and it's and it's honestly, if I spend a lot of time in the visionary space, it's draining.

SPEAKER_02 29:57

What's your working genius type? What's your two I'm towards the end. So you're more um like D and E or EMT or something like that. Right. For those who don't know, working six working genius is by far the most important um test you can take to determine where your energy in a business activity is going to generate from. And so, you know, the the the coaching and the tenacity, which is the doingness of things, there's not one that's better than the other. There's just there's different strengths around the equally important. Equally. There's not one that's more useful than the other. And you have to have a balance of a team that does all those things. You don't need one person can never be a team ever.

SPEAKER_01 30:35

Yeah. And so that's where Adam and I have have opposing, not opposing, but complimentary. But I definitely lean more towards the doing this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like is if you give me, you give me your vision, I'm immediately going down the rabbit hole about how that's gonna how we how are we gonna do that? Exactly. But but coming up with a bit and so that's um but recognizing that and that um having you and having Adam as partners has been so beneficial in the things that we've done together is I've had to have it. Yeah. I mean it it's hard for me doing things myself.

Profit Leaks Delegation Opportunity Cost

SPEAKER_02 31:15

Well, and the reverse is true for me. I really struggle on um doing the coaching, the one-on-one facilitation with a team member. I had to correct a team member yesterday. Uh, I don't have that many people underneath me in the org board, but this one person slept in. And I'm just like, the the the amount of frustration I have on those discussions, I can have them now just because I'm older and experienced. And I was just like the energy drain perpetuated for hours afterwards. Really? And like a loving coach is like all about all those discussions the hard, the good, the positive, and like honestly, I don't even like the good ones. I'm just I'm serious. I like I just I need a whiteboard and I need a group of people who are gonna tell me which ideas suck and how to get it done. Because that's all I have are ideas.

SPEAKER_01 31:59

Yeah, yeah, I get it. Yeah, so there's even now there's struggles. Um, but can I can I share yesterday I had a call with uh a client, uh not a client, a prospective client, because I've got a this new program that I'm doing. What's it called? It's called um well the current name is Profit Intelligence Program. It's where I'd be a fractional CFO. So I could come in.

SPEAKER_02 32:22

Oh, yeah, we talked about this. I think this is your best one.

SPEAKER_01 32:24

Yeah, so I can come in and look over some of your key metrics and tell you where you're leaking revenue, frankly.

SPEAKER_02 32:30

Like, it's so what I love about it is that it's so black and white. Like there's so many coaching things that matter, like, hey, help me build a culture, let's build your purpose. Yay, I feel good. How do I get leaders? Now, how do you draw that to profitability? Like it's um it is vital, by the way, that you do that, but it's it's harder to see. Whereas if someone comes in and says, hey, you've got a leaky pot right here, let's patch it and then immediately you retain more water, you're like, that was a good action. Yeah, I can help you make$50,000 this year without seeing any more patients.

SPEAKER_01 32:56

Right. Right. Like who doesn't want that? Yeah. So uh anyways, I was talking to someone and it was interesting because she she's on, they are on the journey. There's two uh owners, and they're on the journey, and um and they've they've made a lot of money this year. It's their busiest year ever. Nice. But they are working 15-hour days, seven days a week, don't have any hobbies, don't have time to read a book. I said, I've got this podcast. They're like, we don't have time to listen to podcasts. That's sad. Yeah, it's that kind of thing. Very judgmentally determined. Doing their own bookkeeping, running their own payroll. Come on. Yeah. And I just I at one at one time I had to be frank with them and tell them, listen, you're too big, you can't do it all anymore. But I had to follow that up with you guys are exactly where you guys are doing amazing things. Yeah. You've got an amazing company. This is part of the journey. Right. I don't think you can really bypass it. Whether it's for a long time or a short period of time, you have to go through the growing pains. If you want to grow. Now they could scale back and just be in a happy space that has a nice 15 to 20% profit margin and never grow again and see all the patients and do all the fun things. But I don't think entrepreneurs start a business to do that ever. Most of the time.

SPEAKER_02 34:17

No.

SPEAKER_01 34:18

There might be people who are like, well, I have come across a couple people who are like, one guy was a surgeon, he's like, the surgical room is my heaven. Like, that's all I want to do all day long is do surgeries.

SPEAKER_02 34:32

Which is pretty amazing.

SPEAKER_01 34:34

We need people like that. We do. Um some I'm sure there's some dentist out there who's like, if I can just get in as many medics as possible, then my life work is complete. I'm sure there are people like that. Yes. Some of them are in prison.

SPEAKER_03 34:59

So stupid. So yeah. Oh woo. Okay. What were we talking about? I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 35:20

I don't know. Uh so but there are but most entrepreneurs they have like greater dreams. Yes. They're like the idea, it seems like it seems like even when we were in EO, words that would come to mind as people would say them that would inspire others, yeah, is freedom. And uh why else do you do your own thing if it's not to have some freedom? But then when you become slave to the company, you're recognizing there's no freedom in this. I mean it's very taxable. It's the emyth revisited for every small business owner. And I shared that book with them. Like this is very what I had to tell them was you guys are doing amazing things. This is all very normal. You are on the path of ownership. And there is more to look forward to. You just have to learn some skill sets. You have to learn to delegate, and you have to invest in the business by hiring experts. And you have to, it's no more about how much you can do on your own and pulling up your bootstraps and just getting down in the muck and getting it done. It's it's not like that anymore. You're you gotta act like adults who have a million-dollar business and make million-dollar decisions and stop looking at things as expenses but as investments. Hire a bookkeeper for hell's sake.

SPEAKER_02 36:43

Like let's get serious. Delegate anything, it's a that it's a whole buy back your time method of like when you can I when you start devaluating your time and you start putting a financial marker to it, and you start delegating everything below that marker, and then you start measuring. For me, the big thing was measuring opportunity cost, meaning what does it cost me to not make those changes?

SPEAKER_01 37:05

If I don't make these changes, how much money am I gonna potentially lose?

SPEAKER_02 37:09

Right, because what people think is I'm gonna do my bookkeeping, that saves me$300 a month.

unknown 37:13

Right.

SPEAKER_02 37:13

Absolutely, yes. But what they're not calculating is, yeah, I might pay someone$300 a month to do my bookkeeping. But with those three hours a month, what if I was working in my genius and I was bringing in, well, how many more if I'm treating patients, how many more patients could I do? Or if I'm developing the business, how many more therapists could I hire over a year? And now we're talking about that$300 monthly dollar like savings compared to tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars of lost opportunity when we start objectively measuring it. That's why I like that program so much. I think when you start showing them the buckets, and how did they respond to that, by the way, that couple yesterday?

SPEAKER_01 37:47

They well, they weren't they honestly they weren't a fit for my program because they were so discombobulated. Like they I could go, they were at a point. I knew that I could go in and get them the data that they need to make some changes and increase their revenue. Would they make the change? They didn't have the bandwidth to make changes.

SPEAKER_02 38:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:09

Like I was just gonna be more noise, is what I gathered. So I directed them honestly to um they needed some they had in-house billing, and that in-house biller needed a ton of support.

SPEAKER_02 38:23

Got it.

SPEAKER_01 38:23

Yeah, I'm like, you're losing money right there, right now. Right? But I I said all that just because it was a most recent experience yesterday, but also they're overwhelmed, they're just like you and I were, and that's just part of the journey. I mean, you got you gotta go through that lesson. Like, I'm excited to see where that those owners are.

SPEAKER_02 38:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:48

Where are they gonna be in 10 years? Yes. Because we were there 12 years ago, 15 years ago, right? Yeah, exact same situation.

SPEAKER_02 38:56

You know what's interesting too for me is that as I've evolved and starting to hit new new barriers for growth because of my lack of knowledge and my lack of control, I'm learning the same lessons. I'm just learning them at a deeper level. So, like the whole getting someone else to do things for you goes to Benjamin Hardy's book, Who Not How. And so, as you know, I'm looking to hire someone who's gonna actually be my COO and run my business.

SPEAKER_01 39:18

That's a huge investment.

SPEAKER_02 39:20

It's a huge investment. And it's it and it took um, so I was talking to Layla Hermozi, who told me this directly. She goes, she's a one of my, she's a a coach or a mentor type of person. Name drop. I know. Did you hear that? Subtle. I don't even know anyone here even knows. I don't our crowd probably doesn't even know who that is. It's they're a big deal in our world. They should. They should know everything. Look her up online. She's kind of a big deal. Alex and Layla Horsey. She was talking to me personally the other day. We were braiding each other's hair, and she's like, hey, well, does this make me look fat? I'm like, what? I don't know where this is going on. I said, I said to her, I said, uh, she tells me, she goes, she goes, there's a major mental transition that happens once your business hits around two, three million in revenue. And she goes, it really becomes more of something you have to relearn every every little stage, and that is that your value you bring as an owner has little to do with your effort and more to do with your judgment. Getting to the million mark, it's effort.

SPEAKER_01 40:20

It is effort.

SPEAKER_02 40:21

Beyond that, it's your ability to make decisions accurately.

SPEAKER_01 40:24

Yes. Leadership team, strategies and systems. Yeah. What you do with your time.

SPEAKER_02 40:29

All these things. She goes, and she was saying that if you aren't as sharp as you possibly can, you're not getting the sleep or exercise you need, if you're not doing those things, and you're like, and it feels awkward, it feels weird because when you're not, as Alex says directly, until your world is perfectly quiet, you don't know what the best thing is to do for the for the business. You have to have almost a state of boredom from a lack of things to do in your own business before you have the space to generate the best judgment to make these 10x decisions for scale. And that's that was a real, I mean, it's it's more of that same lesson that I'm learning over and over again. When I started Virtual Rockstar, I was very quick to hire for every little thing that I was doing. Okay, I started doing sales that's hire a salesperson. Don't like having one person that's hire multiple, you know, just started like building these systems and people around me to where I was trying to get, but see, now we've hit this stage in our growth where I don't know what to do now. I've never built a company beyond the stage where I'm at now. Got it. So now it's time to bring in an expert at a totally different, riskier thing. And I I know I'm making the right decision because it scares me like there's no other. And I think that's the thing you and I might might say to our younger versions of ourselves is the way you know you're doing the right thing is by signing up with that super expensive coaching company. Have you ever regretted any money that you've ever spent with our with any of the coaches or consultants that we've spent? Never. How much do you think we've spent? If you had if you had to put a number on the money we've spent over the years on coaches, how much do you think we put?

SPEAKER_01 41:55

Is you think it's 250,000? Yeah. Easy. I would say. Easy. Never regretted a penny of it. No. Yeah. No, you're right. And and and I I love what you're saying there because that owner's when I'm telling that owner that they need to get a bookkeeper. Yeah. She has that same fear as you hiring a six-figure COO.

SPEAKER_02 42:22

Right.

SPEAKER_01 42:22

It's the same fear.

SPEAKER_02 42:24

It's it's no different. And it's these, it's the fear that keeps us there because, like, for me, there's a lazy factor now at my age where I'm like, yeah, I remember the first time I hired a bookkeeper and it didn't work. And it was like the book, the bookkeeper I have now is like the fifth one.

SPEAKER_03 42:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:38

And I don't want to go through that process with my right hand. Like that seems impossible. But you're also playing it at such a higher level that I would argue, and I'm gonna put to the universe, that I'm also leveraging a, I'm not, I'm doing it smarter. Like I am way leveraging better people and expertise. I'm not afraid to pay top dollar anymore because I learned the hard way that usually you pay what you get for, not always, but the vast majority of the time. Yes. So if you had to go back in time to a younger Nathan, like let's say you just opened your doors off of Jermaine and Alma School, that for those of you in here in Zodiac, you're losing your minds right now. You're like, he's in Alma School. It's like this really funny street name, but that's where your first clinic was, Germaine and Alma School. And like, let's say he opened his doors and then you showed up from a time machine, and you just pop out, and you're like, after you go through the whole, like, you know, is it me and then the numbers behind my back and that kind of thing, like you know, it's really you. What would be the advice you would give him? And you only have 60 seconds. That's another thing in this game, because that time portal is gonna close itself, and then you're stuck, you're stuck in uh 2003.

Scaling Lessons Judgment And Fear

SPEAKER_01 43:39

Yeah, it'd be something along the lines of listen, invest in experts who can get you wanna get you where you want to go faster. And as you do that, you will find greater purpose, you're you will find uh A v a much more expansive vision for what you can do and be beyond this clinic. I think that would blow my mind.

SPEAKER_02 44:09

Yeah. That was actually really well said, mate. Oh, thanks. Because you also hit upon this idea of unlimited potential. Because like at the time, I guess, like you and I both, I was I dreamed of the day of having a hundred visits per week in another therapist and being able to take four weeks off a year. That just seemed like an unreal life. Paradise. Make make a hundred thousand a year. Yeah. Live off that richness until I sail off in my yacht. Like that's how I dreamed. And now you look back and it's like, yeah, now you're coaching people with multiple locations. You're managing, you know, you've experienced multimillion dollar sales and you're, you know, filling the space on stages and rooms for hours on end without any hesitation. But I think all that time, isn't it true? I mean, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but don't you think all those years of struggle, you were really digging a well of knowledge that you later pulled from when in that two hours, maybe the reason you weren't scared was because you had been in so much suffering and learning that you had earned this well of knowledge that when it was time without preparation, you were able to dip into that well and just pull it out.

SPEAKER_01 45:08

Yeah, just dip in from the pool of wisdom, you know, the learned experience over time, right? One other thing I would tell myself, and and we'll get back to that, uh, that I that you brought up, I had I did have that thought exercise in my mind one time. I think it was at church, and it was something along the lines of what what in my current situation, so this was like 15 years ago, in the middle of the struggle, what would my older self, 90-year-old self, come back and tell me? So imagine myself at 90. What would my 90-year-old self tell me right now?

SPEAKER_03 45:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:40

And that was more along the lines of, dude, you don't have to s worry about it so much. Yeah. Don't let don't let fear hold you back.

SPEAKER_02 45:48

I think that's a big one for me too.

SPEAKER_01 45:50

Right. I mean, you're you were so enveloped by fear every week, depending on the patient volume, the new patient volume, the collections. Like move forward boldly in faith and make some decisions that aren't so fear-based. And I think I would have I I think that's another thing that I would have to tell myself is I I was ruled by fear, I'm ruled by the scarcity of money. And if I could push through that just a little bit, then I will experience a lot more fulfillment and joy. And so that's another thing I would tell myself. But but to go back to what you were talking about. That's amazing. Is um yeah, I because you and I have gone through that, we can pull from that pool of wisdom such that interestingly, in that moment, you know, go back and going back to my original story where I had to fill those those two outs. We were talking about things, and um I remember this distinctly. One woman shared that she had a provider that um needed uh was needed quote unquote more money, right? They needed a raise. Yet she still hadn't met her production expectations, yeah, but needed more money. And uh I don't know why. I was just like, okay, you so you need to have a conversation with her, right? And she's like, Yeah, I need to talk to her this next week. And um, I'm like, okay, you ready to role play it? And she's like, Yeah, I'd love to. And as I'm walking over towards her, I'm like, I don't know how this is gonna go. Live, live. This is like, I don't know if I hope this turns out well so I don't look like a bumbling idiot. Yeah, right, right, right. And bring some wisdom to the to the stage. But we talked through it and she was like, that's exactly what I need to do. And I'm like, oh thankfully I watched enough of uh Will and Adam holding those role play conversations that I could mimic it.

SPEAKER_02 47:54

Listen, you say that, but I was early on with you in those those rooms at Measurable Solutions, and you were you were down with that. Dude, you were so good at those role plays. It was so hard. It's the only way, by the way. All these big successful companies, they roleplay nonstop. It sounds cheesy, but it is the only way.

SPEAKER_01 48:08

Dude, I tell people all the time, you have to roleplay these. Like that's the one thing our team initially hated it. Yeah. But I think they started to recognize the value of it. Right. And I think it's a it's an untapped secret that you could leverage.

SPEAKER_02 48:25

That's like a book title. Role play to success, so that you can like take every situation and practice it with another human being until you find your voice and then go do it. Right?

SPEAKER_01 48:33

Yeah. Like just to go through that with her and then to tell her listen, you need to do this with your husband before you have the conversation, get your words down so that the the fear of not saying the right thing has gone away, and you can focus on the moment and on their response and the emotion and keep yourself grounded, right? Yeah. But um, but that was a that was really a cool experience that again I could draw from that pool of wisdom that the the experience that we've had in the past for the benefit of someone else.

SPEAKER_02 49:04

Yeah, right. Right. Well, that's powerful. I I love the idea of the older version of ourselves coming back and giving us advice, and I know mine would come back. And same thing. I think it's the fear. I think it'd just be like enjoy the process. I think a young, an older version of me would be like, hey man, you're only gonna be young like this once. I know money is like a big concern. It's gonna be fine. Like, do your best and at five o'clock, give your I want almost like my older version to give myself permission to like check out at that point or six o'clock or whatever it was, seven o'clock. Just come home and be home. And then on Saturdays, dude, let it go. And if someone sends you anything, don't check your emails ever after. Like these little things that we all think we know, but having an older version of me give permission to do that would have been so freeing. And I'm sure before he left, he'd turn around and say, Don't forget to moisturize. And then he would leave. And it'd be like, because I and by the way, I'm sure I would have known by looking at him I'd probably need to start moisturizing. Of course. My face looks like a giant pent-up of skin. Mine would have said, uh, do more to keep your hair. What can you do? That's what an impossible, like and by by the way, be four inches taller. Like, well, I can't do that. What am I gonna do?

SPEAKER_01 50:13

Yeah, so I think there's there's there's that part of us that just needs to like give ourselves a little bit more grace and step back and be like, like to that, what I was trying to say to that partnership was like, you've done some awesome stuff. Yeah, man. People want to see you because you're awesome therapists, and you've created an environment which is welcoming and and not just welcoming but generates results. Yeah, give yourself some credit and now let's let's let's actually act like owners. I think I actually tell them told them that you actually need to start acting like owners.

SPEAKER_02 50:49

I like that. It's a call, it's a call of invitation to grow and to be better.

SPEAKER_01 50:53

And there's so I'm I'm recalling so much stuff as we as we're talking. My my mom was not the wealth of wisdom and catchphrases. Right. Like she was a beautiful woman and salt of the earth. But I remember one time like I was gonna graduate from high school in a couple days. I'm like, you know, I'm kind of scared about graduating because I've had so much fun. This has been cool. I don't know how I could get better any better. Yeah. Right. I'm worried about the future because I'm after gonna be an adult and stuff like that. And she, you know, one of her wisdoms was like, you know what, it just gets better. It's different, but it just gets better.

SPEAKER_02 51:30

Oh, no way.

SPEAKER_01 51:30

Yeah, that's really cool. Yeah, there's there's blessings and opportunities that you can't experience at your age. Um, and you get to have a family and children and a wife and and all these cool things and experiences that you can't have when you're in high school, but it's just different. Wow. And so you could say that to people, whatever stage they're in. Like, yeah, it's scary, but it's better. There's a there's better opportunities out there, right? And so I I remember that and I always think about that.

SPEAKER_02 52:02

I love that. You know, Nathan, I think that's a great way to wrap up our show today, just to remind our audience that it's gonna get better. And it's I think one thing that you and I can both say confidently, and I hope this is okay, is is that if we can get to where we are, anyone can get to where we are. Because I, you know, like there was no, you know, with the Adam Robbins, that wasn't me. You know what I mean? I wasn't I wasn't the the Brad Powell's, like I was the guy that was like years of kicking into that. If I didn't have some of these really intense negative things, I would never change.

SPEAKER_01 52:31

But thank you for all that. I'm gonna keep going. Can you imagine like how people see us that we're in that measurable solution? Like we were some of the younger dudes, right? Absolutely. And we were looking up to Brandon and Blaine and Vinog. Chad Elms. How could we ever be like those guys and we're just acting like idiots and you're telling lies at the podium about being in fat camp together and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_02 52:59

And then I told everyone that's how we met with you were my counselor at Fat Camp.

SPEAKER_01 53:02

We were the counselors at Fat Camp. And um and but we're the guys now that have the podcast and the coaching companies. I know. They're probably looking at us like, how did those guys do that?

SPEAKER_02 53:13

I don't know. You know what's it's funny, those guys as we see them now, they have like a million clinics now. So it's just funny how I still kind of feel that way with those guys because they're so freaking amazing. I'm like, how can you you're the one that should be having the podcast with you guys? I agree.

SPEAKER_01 53:27

I agree. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:29

Well, I Nathan, thank you for everything. This was such a great show. I appreciate it. I know everyone got a lot out of it. So please plug your program, your podcast, all the things. So plug, plug, plug.

How To Work With Nathan

SPEAKER_01 53:38

If you haven't listened, the Private Practice Owners Club Podcast.

SPEAKER_02 53:40

Can we argue if you haven't listened to this show? It's uh I'm shaming all my audience.

SPEAKER_01 53:44

I think there's a ton of value. I'm really proud of my library, and that's not just self-serving. I can I listen to my episodes once in a while. I'm like, that was awesome. Yeah. Whether it was me or the guest. Right. I'm like, that was awesome. Um I think there's a ton of value there. Um to go along with that, there's the Facebook group, Private Practice Owners Club Facebook group.

SPEAKER_02 54:03

It's one of the most active serving Facebook groups in the industry. 100%. Oh, that's cool. I love how you guys run that.

SPEAKER_01 54:09

And um, and then we have the coaching program, of course. So if you are in one of these stages and you're like, if someone could just tell me what to do, that would help. Always reach out to us, Nathan at PPOClub.com. Or Adam at PPOClub.com. Of course, we have ppoclub.com website that has all the things. Has all has our under resources, it has our podcast library, which you can use a search menu to find the topics you want to learn about, or the events page where we're gonna have our next webinars and conferences. We have our October conference in San Antonio in October 2026, October 15th through 17th in San Antonio.

SPEAKER_02 54:48

Go if you haven't been, they're amazing.

SPEAKER_01 54:49

Yeah, they're awesome. Um, it'll be our third, and they're just getting better. And um, we always have webinars, we always have we'll have more con in in-person workshops, you know, the the more intimate settings. And then my new program, it's it's a fractional CFO program that um currently is in the pilot stages. So with early 2026, if you're listening to this, it's in the early pilot stages. I'm welcome.

SPEAKER_02 55:13

I'm happy to bring people on because I need to improve my systems and oh my gosh, so they get a huge deal and they get the huge program just to be able to work through it with you.

SPEAKER_01 55:23

Huge discount to help you find tens of thousands of dollars. Come on. Like I was doing audits on clinics last year that were just like one and done things. Like, give me this data, I will analyze it and give you a report where you can make money. And you know, I was punching out the numbers, and there was one company that uh like a$2.8 million PT practice to clinics. And no joke, I found where if they made a few changes, not easy, but few changes, could easily make another$200,000 a year.

SPEAKER_02 55:57

Of profit? Insane.

SPEAKER_01 56:00

Of profit.

SPEAKER_02 56:01

That's like money in your pocket.

SPEAKER_01 56:02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 56:04

Talk about opportunity costs. Totally change the guys, jump on this program while you how many people are you able to take?

SPEAKER_01 56:10

Well, I'd hard to say, like at the time that this comes out, right? I've got a few people now taking a couple more.

SPEAKER_02 56:16

So yeah, you want to be one of the few people, jump on it.

SPEAKER_01 56:18

Yeah, exactly. I can take a couple more. Um, but this will continue to grow, right? So now I'm not just doing the audit at the beginning every other week. I'm looking at some of your metrics and telling you, hey, focus over here.

Final Goodbye

SPEAKER_02 56:30

You know, give you one or two prescriptions to not heavy lifting, it's like, hey, just go focus on this one step at a time.

SPEAKER_01 56:35

Yeah, you could have three to five things to work on. I'm just gonna say this will get you the most money the fastest if you correct it, right? Over-the-counter collections or billing or productivity or that kind of stuff. Um and so that's the idea is I can come in and show you where you're losing money or leaking money and plug those holes and make more profit, right? And so it's a bi-weekly thing with monthly reports as well. And and so that's where I'm going right now with that. I'm really excited about it.

SPEAKER_02 57:01

Well, Nathan, as always, thanks for being on the show. And while you're probably posting this on your show as well, thank you, PPO listeners, as well. And yeah, um, have a great rest of your time. I'm sure we're gonna just watch the wonderful growth of that company as it goes. But yeah, thanks for all that you do.

SPEAKER_01 57:15

Thanks, man. It was awesome.